April 2, 2025

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1990) - Part Two: Raphael's Rage and Donatello's Development. Splinter the Master of Mentoring, Family and Ninjitsu!

Episode Overview:

What makes a person gravitate toward Leonardo, Donatello, Raphael, or Michelangelo? According to Aaron, a classroom teacher by day and podcast host by night, your favourite Ninja Turtle reveals more about your personality than you might think. We unpack this fascinating psychology while diving deep into the groundbreaking 1990 Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles film.

Raphael's Emotional Journey and Donatello's Lack of Development:
The film's attempt to balance the darker comic book origins with the lighter animated series created something uniquely special, though not without its contradictions. We explore Raphael's emotional journey as he learns to channel his anger constructively, while lamenting Donatello's underdevelopment despite being a fan favourite. The practical action sequences—with their Power Rangers-esque fighting style—remind us of an era before CGI dominated action filmmaking.

Mentors and Family in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles:
Perhaps most compelling is our discussion of Master Splinter as the ideal mentor figure, offering wisdom and warmth in contrast to Shredder's predatory exploitation of vulnerable youth. This lens reveals surprising depth in what could have been dismissed as just another children's film. The turtles' unconventional family unit—with all its dysfunction, conflict, and ultimate loyalty—continues to resonate across generations because it reflects our own complex family dynamics.

Key Takeaways:

• Discussing how each turtle's personality connects to different types of people – Leonardo (leadership), Donatello (tech-savvy), Raphael (emotional), Michelangelo (fun-loving)
• Examining the underdevelopment of Donatello in the film despite his importance in other TMNT adaptations
• Analyzing Raphael's emotional journey as he learns to channel his anger and trust his family
• Critiquing the film's uneven dialogue, which ranges from teen slang to overly expository
• Evaluating the practical action sequences, considering the limitations of the turtle suits
• Discussing the tonal balance between the darker comic book source material and the lighter animated series
• Highlighting Master Splinter as the ideal mentor figure in contrast to the predatory Shredder
• Exploring how the turtles represent a non-traditional but loving family unit that continues to resonate with audiences

Apple Podcast Tags:

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, TMNT 1990, Jim Henson, Raphael TMNT, Leonardo TMNT, Donatello TMNT, Michelangelo TMNT, Shredder TMNT, Splinter TMNT, TMNT Movie Review, TMNT Nostalgia, 90s Movies, Comic Book Movies, Geek Freaks Network, Fandom Portals Podcast

Instagram: instagram.com/fandomportals/?locale=en
Threads: threads.net/@fandomportals
Email: fandomportals@gmail.com
Letterboxd: https://letterboxd.com/fandomportals

Chapters

00:13 - Welcome to Phantom Portals Podcast

01:17 - Introducing the 1990 TMNT Movie

01:37 - Exploring the Turtles' Personalities

05:26 - Popcorn Perspectives: Donatello's Character

14:51 - Raphael's Character Development and Arc

22:19 - Real Deal: Rating the Dialogue

29:33 - Evaluating the Action Sequences

35:53 - Discussing the Movie's Tonal Balance

42:47 - Most Valuable Takeaways: Role Models

49:40 - Family Bonds in TMNT

58:13 - Rating and Closing Thoughts

Transcript

WEBVTT

00:00:13.856 --> 00:00:14.416
Hello everybody.

00:00:14.416 --> 00:00:17.905
It's Aaron here from the Phantom Portals podcast, joined as always by my co-host Brash.

00:00:17.905 --> 00:00:18.347
What's going on?

00:00:18.347 --> 00:00:20.687
Cowabunga dude, oh Cowabunga we're back again.

00:00:21.361 --> 00:00:22.827
I prefer Cowabunga.

00:00:25.242 --> 00:00:28.219
We're back again for the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles from 1990.

00:00:28.219 --> 00:00:31.570
This one was directed by Steve Barron, by writers Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird.

00:00:31.570 --> 00:00:33.468
They were actually the creators of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

00:00:33.468 --> 00:00:39.573
It's starring Judith Hogue and Elias Cochez as April O'Neill and Casey Jones respectively.

00:00:39.573 --> 00:00:46.414
This one was our portalist pick, which means our community picked for us to do this one, more specifically by Oriole Seth.

00:00:46.414 --> 00:00:48.000
Thank you from our threads community.

00:00:48.000 --> 00:00:51.549
You suggested this one and our community voted it as the one they wanted us to do.

00:00:52.520 --> 00:01:02.027
So the teenage mutant Ninja turtles is a movie that features four teenage mutant Ninja turtles, believe it or not, that emerged from the shadows to protect New York city from a gang of criminal ninjas.

00:01:02.027 --> 00:01:09.168
Now, in this episode, we're going to be talking about the characters of Raphael and Donatello.

00:01:09.168 --> 00:01:10.817
More specifically, in our Popcorn Perspectives segment.

00:01:10.817 --> 00:01:14.971
We're going to be doing a real deal segment and we're going to be talking about our most valuable takeaways.

00:01:14.971 --> 00:01:17.646
So let's get into it right now.

00:01:17.646 --> 00:01:26.712
Our Popcorn Perspectives segment is where the hosts take one character from the media each and analyze the development and growth throughout the movie.

00:01:26.712 --> 00:01:35.960
We express to our co-host how this character should have been viewed in your opinion and the meaningful connections the character arc has to the themes or the plot of the movie Brash.

00:01:35.960 --> 00:01:41.412
Before we get started on our specific turtles, let's have a little bit of a talk about the turtles in general.

00:01:41.412 --> 00:01:42.784
So all four of them put together.

00:01:42.784 --> 00:01:43.968
They're very different, aren't they?

00:01:44.221 --> 00:01:52.150
Yes, but I have opinions, yes, or thoughts which will lead into my topic.

00:01:52.531 --> 00:01:52.932
Very good.

00:01:52.932 --> 00:01:58.840
Okay, so my favorite thing about the turtles is so everybody knows, I'm a classroom teacher.

00:01:58.840 --> 00:02:06.049
A lot of people might ask you know, to get to know somebody, you know what's your star sign, or they might ask you what's your favorite color.

00:02:06.049 --> 00:02:10.831
But one thing I always ask who's your favorite turtle Students, exactly what's your favorite turtle?

00:02:10.831 --> 00:02:15.711
And the reason I ask that is because I can get a really good read on what that kid is like based on the turtle that they enjoy.

00:02:15.711 --> 00:02:19.311
So if they're a kid that really likes Donatello, for example, they might be into gaming.

00:02:19.311 --> 00:02:27.437
They might be into you know, and they might be very, very kind as well, because Donatello's very very kind.

00:02:27.856 --> 00:02:33.389
If they like Michelangelo, they're obviously into a little bit of fun, like there's just some psychological, skateboarding, surfing, that sort of sporty sort of stuff.

00:02:33.599 --> 00:02:38.657
If they're Leonardo, more serious probably Leadership orientation.

00:02:38.697 --> 00:02:49.123
Likes taking charge or captain a football team or something like that, and then Raphael, football team or something like that.

00:02:49.123 --> 00:02:50.287
Uh, and then rafael, obviously you've got all your violence.

00:02:50.287 --> 00:02:55.483
Yeah, you're just just just, yeah, bad apples, yeah, all those kids that need a little bit of a bit of support and uh, yeah, or you know, conversely as well, sometimes rafael is the, the character that sensitive kids like as well.

00:02:55.522 --> 00:03:08.835
Yeah, as I say like, like is like the ones that um like have that out of, like tough out of shell, but uh, stuff in the middle, yeah, exactly so, yeah, they all have their different kind of, and that's the appeal of the turtles, is that they're so different.

00:03:08.879 --> 00:03:14.284
They all have their different skills and strengths and kids are drawn on, people are drawn to a different one.

00:03:14.284 --> 00:03:18.348
So it's very good to get to know somebody if you want to talk to them about their favorite turtle.

00:03:18.348 --> 00:03:19.431
So, brash, who's your favorite turtle?

00:03:19.431 --> 00:03:20.552
Mine's actually Donatello.

00:03:20.552 --> 00:03:27.198
Oh man, my little brother, dylan, shout out Dylan, how you going buddy and my son, river loved Donatello.

00:03:27.198 --> 00:03:30.501
Yep, and you know what, growing up I thought he was the least popular turtle.

00:03:30.984 --> 00:03:32.343
Yeah, really Well.

00:03:32.343 --> 00:03:35.513
I mean, in a way, I can sort of also see that who's your favourite.

00:03:35.675 --> 00:03:39.949
My favourite turtle growing up always was Leonardo.

00:03:39.949 --> 00:03:48.579
The way that I liked Leonardo was because he had the best weapon, he was obviously in charge of the turtles and he was very morally correct.

00:03:48.579 --> 00:03:50.146
I have a very strong sense of justice.

00:03:50.146 --> 00:03:53.159
Whether that's good or bad, that's just where I align.

00:03:53.159 --> 00:03:57.330
But since I've become a man, and.

00:03:57.330 --> 00:03:58.599
I'm watching the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

00:03:58.741 --> 00:04:08.542
I actually like Raphael a lot better yeah, he has that sort of and they do show it in a lot of the shows where he goes from, like he's at the heart at Shelby's probably the most sensitive of the lot.

00:04:08.542 --> 00:04:11.725
Like out of all of them he's probably the most prone to cry yeah, exactly.

00:04:12.026 --> 00:04:27.827
Well, that's that's why I like him too, because looking at him, I can see that you know, I have a pretty sensitive temperament and he also has a pretty sensitive temperament, and the reason that he seems so aggressive outwardly is because he has a lot of emotions and he's trying to deal with them in the best way that he can.

00:04:27.827 --> 00:04:29.723
So that's my transition with.

00:04:29.723 --> 00:04:35.569
My favorite sort of turtle was Leonardo, now Raphael, and I know psychologically why I was drawn to them too.

00:04:36.180 --> 00:04:37.706
Yeah, leonardo has to be like.

00:04:37.706 --> 00:04:38.810
He was always my second favorite.

00:04:38.810 --> 00:04:40.343
And then Raph.

00:04:40.343 --> 00:04:42.490
I hated Mikey Really.

00:04:42.490 --> 00:04:43.980
I thought he was just annoying.

00:04:43.980 --> 00:04:44.889
He's never been my favorite, but I never hated him.

00:04:44.826 --> 00:04:45.418
I hated Mikey really.

00:04:45.418 --> 00:04:45.759
I thought he was just annoying.

00:04:45.759 --> 00:04:46.064
He's never been my favourite but I never hated him.

00:04:46.144 --> 00:04:46.906
I wouldn't say I hated him.

00:04:46.906 --> 00:04:52.298
He was just my least favourite because I thought he was like I thought he was more annoying than anything else yeah, he was a a liability.

00:04:52.298 --> 00:04:58.127
He was loud, he was a liability to the team and that as because we've both been watching Black Clover lately.

00:04:58.127 --> 00:04:59.401
Yeah, aster's the same.

00:04:59.641 --> 00:05:00.403
I can.

00:05:00.742 --> 00:05:01.704
I'm struggling through it.

00:05:01.704 --> 00:05:03.608
I've already watched it all before, but I'm struggling through it again.

00:05:03.608 --> 00:05:13.630
But I'm like, oh my God, it's just how annoying and loud after it is always yeah, exactly, and I think it's just gotten even more for me since I've gotten older and gotten grumpier.

00:05:14.380 --> 00:05:16.608
That like loud noises just piss me off.

00:05:16.608 --> 00:05:26.713
Yeah, in terms of Michelangelo, when they're representing him in a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles movie or TV show, there is definitely a fine line, and I've watched some representations of Mikey where he is just absolutely annoying.

00:05:26.713 --> 00:05:27.514
Can't stand him, yeah.

00:05:27.514 --> 00:05:33.105
But then there are some times where he is just enough to break the serious tone of whatever they're trying to do.

00:05:33.519 --> 00:05:39.649
And I find that in the 2003, the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles show that one there.

00:05:39.649 --> 00:05:42.000
That's when I actually was like, oh yeah, yeah.

00:05:42.021 --> 00:05:42.663
He was a spot on.

00:05:42.663 --> 00:05:43.685
I reckon he was really good.

00:05:43.685 --> 00:05:48.749
Yeah, yeah, if you're going to watch any Turtles, guys go out and watch that TMNT from 2023.

00:05:48.749 --> 00:05:53.208
And this one, in my opinion, the 1990 version of Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

00:05:53.208 --> 00:05:54.843
But we have digressed.

00:05:54.843 --> 00:05:55.947
We must have digressed.

00:05:55.947 --> 00:05:56.790
We have digressed.

00:05:56.790 --> 00:06:04.887
This is our Popcorn Perspective segment, and Brash has picked Donatello to talk about in terms of his character arc, and I have picked Raphael.

00:06:04.887 --> 00:06:06.689
So, brash, would you like to take us away with Donatello?

00:06:06.769 --> 00:06:13.396
So Donatello, he's the well, I would say, the most more intelligent tech savvy, the turtle, hence why?

00:06:13.396 --> 00:06:16.536
As you said in our last episode how he's got the stick?

00:06:16.536 --> 00:06:21.185
Because Splinter Woman seems to be more simplistic, because his fancy gadgets and everything like that.

00:06:21.185 --> 00:06:22.326
They don't do that in this movie.

00:06:23.968 --> 00:06:24.269
They don't.

00:06:24.269 --> 00:06:29.375
I actually don't see him with a gadget or inventing or on a computer at all.

00:06:29.375 --> 00:06:33.430
The closest we get to it is the middle scene on the farm where he is helping Casey Jones fix the vehicle.

00:06:33.540 --> 00:06:35.468
And he has no idea what he's doing.

00:06:35.468 --> 00:06:42.468
Like to be fair enough, they're like teenagers, but realistically, if you were to take Donatello out of that movie, I don't think anything would change.

00:06:43.269 --> 00:06:44.331
I kind of agree with you there.

00:06:44.331 --> 00:06:46.115
He's definitely the most underdeveloped turtle.

00:06:46.115 --> 00:06:52.862
I think he and Mikey sort of sit together a lot because they're almost the lighter tone yeah and that's my second thing.

00:06:53.524 --> 00:06:56.482
I love the fact that in this they seem very teenage.

00:06:56.482 --> 00:07:15.817
All of them seem very teenage and I love that because they're meant to be teenage ninja turtles, not 30-something year old men playing teenagers, and I I love that fact and it comes off like in some of the childish antics that they get up to and everything like that and the way they speak and everything like that and their cockiness and everything.

00:07:15.817 --> 00:07:17.305
It's just all perfect.

00:07:17.305 --> 00:07:25.821
But I feel like Donatello is left because there's no specific and I think I think it might be.

00:07:25.821 --> 00:07:36.252
Tello is left because there's no specific and I think it might be because of the sort of the time that it was made, the movie was made and probably constraints on length and budget and budget.

00:07:36.252 --> 00:07:38.173
They couldn't really do any sort of thing.

00:07:38.173 --> 00:07:41.255
Like techie, Realistically, when he's helping Casey fix that car.

00:07:41.255 --> 00:07:47.845
Donatello, realistically, he built their turn on the bill Like he should be able to fix that in a second.

00:07:47.845 --> 00:07:51.170
He should go get some paper clips and some chewing gum and turn that thing into a rocket ship.

00:07:51.290 --> 00:07:55.055
Yeah, he's um, that's his special talent, yeah.

00:07:55.194 --> 00:07:57.305
He's, he's the MacGyver of the group.

00:07:57.305 --> 00:07:58.290
He like he can turn.

00:07:58.290 --> 00:08:07.934
He lived in a sewer scrap and makes a supercomputer and they don't do any of that in um like yes, they're.

00:08:07.934 --> 00:08:20.509
All they really had to work off was the comics and the um, the cartoon which had some techie aspects, I think even in the cartoon he was quite, he was quite tech savvy, but they probably didn't.

00:08:20.589 --> 00:08:31.021
There wasn't really like in the later ones where they had their big turtle computer, supercomputer and all the hoverboards and everything like that, and the shell phones and the shell phones yeah, the goggles Like.

00:08:31.060 --> 00:08:35.274
He was always the one in the later cartoons that carried the sports bag full of gear.

00:08:35.274 --> 00:08:35.855
Full of gear.

00:08:35.855 --> 00:08:43.902
Yeah, all the others were obviously travel light because they were obviously offensive or defensive in mind for the Ninja Turtles mission, but he always carried a bag of stuff.

00:08:44.003 --> 00:08:49.894
So yeah, I understand that, but I just felt like he just didn't get to do Donnie things.

00:08:49.894 --> 00:08:53.745
Yeah, he didn't get to be him, he was just like a secondary.

00:08:54.067 --> 00:08:54.589
Michelangelo?

00:08:54.589 --> 00:08:55.552
Yeah, I think so too.

00:08:55.552 --> 00:08:58.457
He was the one that Michelangelo reacted to Michelangelo's jokes.

00:08:58.678 --> 00:09:00.043
Yeah, and Michelangelo and.

00:09:00.083 --> 00:09:06.326
Donnie were there to offset the tension that was there between Leonardo and Raphael.

00:09:06.326 --> 00:09:22.101
I think, like they always portrayed Donatello as the smarter, more nerdy turtle, and they did kind of have a tiny little moment of that at the very start, when they're trying to riff off their new catchphrase and they're saying, like you know, to make fun of him, use some like flashy word and they're like what?

00:09:22.201 --> 00:09:26.327
he's like bossa nova, and then it's like bossa nova, and then they turn around and make fun of him, and then it's like chevy nova, chevy nova.

00:09:26.327 --> 00:09:27.171
It's almost like you know.

00:09:27.171 --> 00:09:39.927
He's just like excellent, yeah, it's like how the you know, the nerd of the group doesn't really get the social context and doesn't really get the like the in words at the time, so they turn around.

00:09:39.927 --> 00:09:45.195
The only really thing that you see, that develops his character a little bit in this movie it's more making fun of him because he's a nerd, yeah yeah.

00:09:45.961 --> 00:09:48.469
The only thing that shows him as a nerd is him being made fun of.

00:09:48.469 --> 00:10:25.558
Yeah, so that was my take on Donnie in the movie, which was a little bit disappointing Because when I was re-watching it again, I was like it's Donatello, sorry, not Donate's Leonardo, raphael, michelangelo and Michelangelo too, yeah, yeah, yeah, because, like him and Mikey were always together, buddied up and they like, like, when they had the dancing scene with the tequila, they were the ones dancing together doing the tequila, while, um, this is one of the things that freaked me out the most was Leonardo, which is just sitting there.

00:10:25.558 --> 00:10:30.320
I'm like, guy, stop, that's weird.

00:10:30.320 --> 00:10:31.907
And then Ralph went off to see the movie.

00:10:32.522 --> 00:10:51.322
But, yeah, it was just always Michelangelo doing Michelangelo things and then Donatello sort of being like that nerdy younger brother that has to try and follow behind the cool and agree with all the cool things that the cool brother's doing, because you know he doesn't want to seem like the nerd and yeah.

00:10:51.322 --> 00:10:53.408
So that was a little disappointing for me personally.

00:10:53.408 --> 00:11:04.126
But, um, because, yeah, donatello's my favorite, I love Donatello, but yeah, that was my take on that, which was, yeah, disappointing.

00:11:04.126 --> 00:11:08.793
I loved the fact that Donatello for me in that movie he wasn't Donatello.

00:11:09.114 --> 00:11:24.035
Yeah, and I can see that and I think that you know it might have something to do with the budget constraints this being only made on a $13 million budget and most of it being geared towards the suits and the animatronics and hiring all the actors to actually bring those turtles to life, all the actors to actually bring those turtles to life.

00:11:24.035 --> 00:11:34.687
Maybe they didn't have enough time to develop his character because it's only a 94-minute movie or something like that, and you know we have spoken before about how movies that have multiple characters find it hard to develop a lot of them significantly.

00:11:34.687 --> 00:11:40.865
It'd be interesting to see the, because I actually have never seen Secret of the Ooze, but I have obviously seen Teenage Mutant Ninja.

00:11:40.885 --> 00:11:41.506
Turtles 3.

00:11:41.506 --> 00:11:51.626
I've seen more, but honestly, honestly, I couldn't tell you what happens in the Secret of the Earth yeah, I think I have seen it, but I don't remember it yeah, maybe, maybe he gets more development in that space there.

00:11:51.921 --> 00:11:54.109
but I agree with everything that you said, brash, I think he is.

00:11:54.109 --> 00:12:04.592
He's not the Donatello that I know and love, and you might say that the things we love about Donatello developed in the later cartoons and movies and stuff, but he's definitely that way inclined in the comic books too.

00:12:04.592 --> 00:12:05.835
He's the tech savvy turtle.

00:12:05.835 --> 00:12:06.501
He's the one.

00:12:06.501 --> 00:12:16.368
That's the thing, and you know, all of the action figures that came out in the eighties and the nineties always had Donatello with various different tech gear, so it was definitely part of his character that was missing from this movie.

00:12:16.368 --> 00:12:31.399
Absolutely agree In terms of his arc, usually in this part we talk about his arc.

00:12:31.303 --> 00:12:31.326
He didn't really have an arc.

00:12:31.326 --> 00:12:31.799
No, he didn't, he was just always.

00:12:31.799 --> 00:12:32.168
He was just always the turtle.

00:12:32.168 --> 00:12:32.469
That was just there.

00:12:32.469 --> 00:12:37.981
That if someone needed someone to reply off, like have a reply from, or just someone there's, like if someone's to acknowledge what's being said into further progression of the story, he was there.

00:12:37.981 --> 00:12:42.062
Yeah, but other than that he didn't really have any sort of plot points.

00:12:42.524 --> 00:12:44.366
And mikey's almost the same.

00:12:44.366 --> 00:12:58.988
But Mikey has that comic relief sort of role, purpose, yeah and purpose in the whole movie, because I feel like, out of all of them, it's more about Leonardo and Raphael, which usually is always the case.

00:12:58.988 --> 00:13:05.924
I find, when it comes to Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, it's always Raph and Leo as the mains.

00:13:05.924 --> 00:13:08.827
Well, they sold the most toys, true, well, because they get all the.

00:13:08.827 --> 00:13:16.336
They get all the like, all the screen time, um, but like, like, I'm saying like and they're always the ones that are fighting over who gets to be the leader.

00:13:16.336 --> 00:13:37.625
And then Mikey's always the one trying to cool the heads between Leo and Raph and they're always like Donatello's, just like even in some of the later ones, like they're all fighting and Mikey's trying to break them up and he's off on his computer doing computer-y shit.

00:13:37.907 --> 00:13:38.087
Yeah.

00:13:38.482 --> 00:13:40.927
And not even involved in that sort of thing at all.

00:13:41.279 --> 00:13:47.605
I think it's funny that if we you know how we were talking about Donatello being the sort of nerdy outsider of this crew of turtles Makes sense.

00:13:47.605 --> 00:13:58.748
Well, in the latest one, mutant Mayhem, you see Raph, donnie and also Mikey banding together a lot more and poking more fun at Leo, because he's the one that's always saying we need to follow what Splinter's telling us.

00:13:58.970 --> 00:14:22.946
So it's funny how that cultural shift has happened over the last 35 years, where the turtles represent the teenagers, where you know being being a nerd or being tech savvy like that it is kind of ostracizing, but now it's like following the rules, I guess you could say, and what the adults tell you, and not wanting to sneak out at night and using your phone past curfew is is the thing that is yeah, so like the more straight laced, serious one now is one that gets made fun of.

00:14:23.066 --> 00:14:32.308
Yeah, like sort of like in the Marvel movies how they all make fun of Captain America for like, not like, swearing and swearing and not swearing and the like, and being the stiff straight-laced person.

00:14:32.620 --> 00:14:34.187
Yeah, I think that's an interesting cultural change.

00:14:34.259 --> 00:14:59.303
But in terms of Donatello in this movie, I absolutely agree no arc no-transcript the scene with the with the car, because you only see his, his left arm and his head, yeah, so maybe that was actually just those parts of the the turtle there.

00:14:59.303 --> 00:15:03.629
All right, let's go into, uh, my, my turtle, which is Raphael.

00:15:03.629 --> 00:15:12.446
So, as we spoke about, raphael is definitely the most hot-headed, he's the most emotionally impulsive, he's the most aggressive.

00:15:12.446 --> 00:15:15.649
Anger is something that isn't second nature to him.

00:15:15.649 --> 00:15:27.033
He kind of revolves around that space of feeling, a feeling reacting to a feeling, and he's always really presented as the turtle that is cruel, but cool, but crude, is what they say in the 1987 cartoon.

00:15:27.921 --> 00:15:41.873
He's exemplified by a struggle with internal conflict and that's how we meet Raphael and he's always the one that's kind of alone from the other three brothers and Splinter actually says this in the movie where he says you know, anger clouds the mind turned inwards.

00:15:41.873 --> 00:15:44.528
It is an unconquerable enemy.

00:15:44.528 --> 00:15:48.866
You are unique among your brothers but you choose to face this enemy alone.

00:15:48.866 --> 00:15:50.990
But as you face it, do not forget them.

00:15:50.990 --> 00:15:53.304
So he's always pitted as the one that's by himself.

00:15:53.304 --> 00:16:00.152
We see him putting the trench coat and hat on at the start of the movie where he's going out to see various different movies when he is angry at something.

00:16:00.461 --> 00:16:10.344
on fact, though, the movie that when he comes out and it's the creatures movie that was actually going to be a bad suit, cause at the time Batman was just coming out the 89.

00:16:10.364 --> 00:16:10.664
Batman.

00:16:11.841 --> 00:16:19.090
So there was going to be a reference to him watching, of going and seeing a Batman movie, the Batman movie coming out and saying cool car shit costume yeah.

00:16:19.650 --> 00:16:34.495
Yeah Well, a lot of those scenes were actually shot in New York, but with with that, it actually exemplifies one of the times, one of the many times in the movie where Raph actually goes out on his own because he's feeling a big feeling, Like he's feeling angry or he's feeling upset or he's lost his sigh.

00:16:34.495 --> 00:16:35.897
He's angry with himself.

00:16:35.897 --> 00:16:43.658
He's angry with himself, very self-critical.

00:16:43.658 --> 00:16:46.864
He's the one that has a lot of the dialogue scenes with Splinter and he's also the one that probably has the most growth through the movie.

00:16:46.884 --> 00:16:57.567
In the second act of the movie it's culminating to the point where he goes and does angry gymnastics out on the roof and is spotted by Casey Jones and that's what instigates his spectacular beatdown.

00:16:57.567 --> 00:17:01.024
That actually causes him to be indisposed for the middle part of the movie.

00:17:01.024 --> 00:17:08.868
It's where the Turtles really learn okay, we need to actually gather around Raphael, we need to help support him in his internal conflicts that he's having.

00:17:08.868 --> 00:17:20.586
And it's also where Raphael learns that anger isn't a strength when it's left unchecked or when it is outwardly expressed in an uncontrolled way.

00:17:20.586 --> 00:17:35.987
Strength comes from lessons of emotional intelligence and being able to, you know, be vulnerable, show that raw emotion, but also realize that his isolation and refusal to listen to his brothers is a danger for himself and his family as well.

00:17:35.987 --> 00:17:42.184
So when he learns that, he's then able to come up with different sort of outlets for his anger.

00:17:42.204 --> 00:17:49.007
Speaking on wrath, how they just threw him in that absolutely hilarious.

00:17:49.007 --> 00:17:55.268
He's got like one arm hanging out oh yeah, in the recovery position all one arm hanging out, he's like legs all twisted up and shit.

00:17:55.268 --> 00:18:05.249
And then they come in and like gets a cup of water and just like sprinkle it on his arm it's like the dude's, like like he'd wake up with like every part of him being sore from the way he is positioned.

00:18:05.249 --> 00:18:06.271
It is horrid.

00:18:07.921 --> 00:18:21.682
And you know, there's also the scene where he falls from the roof through the glass onto the antiques shop floor and you actually see him bounce a little bit and they come over and comfort him and they push down on him and you can tell that that's like a rubber mannequin and not really the actor.

00:18:21.682 --> 00:18:29.971
But think that through that it's definitely like a bit a bit comical and 90s aged, you might say as well but no, don't put him in a better thing.

00:18:30.011 --> 00:18:39.371
Like I know he's a turtle and needs water for some reason, but like the thing is, like none of the guys you don't see any other guys speaking water themselves but um, yeah, oh, that made me.

00:18:39.371 --> 00:18:41.886
That made me giggle a bit when I saw that again.

00:18:42.188 --> 00:18:50.028
But in that scene and know, when he wakes up and then ends up reconciling with Leonardo, who he's constantly at odds with, that's when he starts to, you know, accept his family.

00:18:50.028 --> 00:18:57.224
He learns not to suppress his emotions but he learns to channel them constructively and at the end of the movie he's not really an emotion like.

00:18:57.224 --> 00:18:58.269
He hasn't lost those emotions.

00:18:58.269 --> 00:19:01.926
He's still definitely a sensitive sort of person, but he is.

00:19:01.926 --> 00:19:22.032
He is leaning on those that are around him and he's also, uh, learnt some skills and some trust in his family to be able to be himself, show those vulnerable aspects of him and channel them into strength that way, instead of isolating himself, being angry and then lashing out and being thrown into a bathtub in a very unceremonious way.

00:19:22.032 --> 00:19:31.028
But, yeah, I think that that biggest thing for him is by the end of the movie he learns that element of trust which is his growth through the film as well.

00:19:31.028 --> 00:19:35.626
So he definitely goes through the most and that's similar through a lot of Teenage Mutant, ninja Turtles stories, isn't it?

00:19:35.646 --> 00:19:36.450
Raph's usually the one.

00:19:36.450 --> 00:19:42.627
It's always Raph and Leo fighting and it's always Raph coming to terms with his anger issues.

00:19:42.748 --> 00:19:49.630
Yep His issues and in the 2007 animated movie they actually physically fight on the rooftop, you know.

00:19:49.900 --> 00:19:54.311
Yeah, because Raph is dressed up in his Nightwalker.

00:19:54.311 --> 00:19:55.986
Yeah, Nightwalker.

00:19:56.006 --> 00:19:56.587
Something like that, yeah.

00:19:57.820 --> 00:19:59.266
And get up, which is really cool.

00:19:59.326 --> 00:20:01.727
It's really good, Like that movie's actually not too bad.

00:20:01.727 --> 00:20:02.627
That movie.

00:20:02.627 --> 00:20:09.933
That's one of my favourite Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, yeah, and also I'm pretty sure Leonardo is voiced by Yuri Lowenthal in that movie as well, yeah.

00:20:09.933 --> 00:20:11.946
Great voice actor, amazing.

00:20:11.946 --> 00:20:21.250
But yeah, his arc in this in the 1990 version is probably my favorite part of the movie and I also love his friendship with Casey Jones and how that develops as well.

00:20:21.400 --> 00:20:22.605
Because they've always been the closest friends.

00:20:22.625 --> 00:20:26.681
those two Because Jones and how that developed as well, because they've always been the closest friends, those two, because they're very, very similar, yeah, and yeah.

00:20:26.740 --> 00:20:30.049
They're both children that use aggression yeah.

00:20:30.411 --> 00:20:45.295
Yeah, and I think that's why he's popular to a lot of like young boys, because not only do they see a little bit of themselves in him, but they also can see like the way that he presents strength.

00:20:45.295 --> 00:21:07.664
Yeah, I guess you could say and you might like, looking back now, because he was the toughest turtle and he was the one that was outwardly angry a lot of the time you might liken it like to the incredible hulk, where, where the hulk uses his anger as an outlet and then goes and smashes stuff which, if we're looking at a psychological perspective and the way we're sort of trying to parent kids and teach kids, like that's not very constructive.

00:21:07.664 --> 00:21:16.619
You can't really do that like if you get angry, you have rage rooms and I was gonna say you have rooms for that, yeah yeah, but you know, in general, generally speaking, it's not really the way that you deal with anger.

00:21:16.740 --> 00:21:31.913
However, the way that rafael deals with anger in a lot of these stories, where he he does have those outbursts and he does make mistakes, but he always comes back to his family and always tries to, you know, internally work on it through his, uh, emotional understanding of himself and others, that's sort of more like a healthy sort of push.

00:21:31.913 --> 00:21:41.373
It's funny, though, because, like when you, when you're emotionally heightened, you you have two, two options, like when you're feeling emotionally stressed, you know what those two options are let out, but let up.

00:21:41.373 --> 00:21:49.964
Well, yeah, you can do that, like fight or flight, basically, so he can fight verbally, outburst with his brothers, and then flight, which is run away, which is what he does all the time.

00:21:49.964 --> 00:21:57.971
Yeah, so he will go and avoid, and you know, you can take some time to reflect and time to take it in and process what you're feeling.

00:21:57.971 --> 00:22:10.589
But there's also that reconciliation that has to happen afterwards and that understanding which he never gets, because he always gets beaten the crap out of by puttin' inches of Casey Jones which is kind of like a consequence I guess a natural consequence to his inappropriate outbursts of anger.

00:22:10.589 --> 00:22:11.944
He always gets beaten up.

00:22:11.944 --> 00:22:15.045
Consequence to his inappropriate outbursts of anger, he always gets beaten up.

00:22:15.045 --> 00:22:16.971
So that's the lesson for rafael and why he ended up going through the arc that he did.

00:22:17.753 --> 00:22:19.481
All right, let's get to our real deal segment.

00:22:19.481 --> 00:22:31.165
All right, this is our real deal segment, where we randomly select a criteria or lens to the view the movie through.

00:22:31.165 --> 00:22:35.455
We discuss its elements with the intention of finding out whether it can be rated positively or negatively.

00:22:35.455 --> 00:22:40.471
Each week we name these criteria as positive or negative, with a fun element of the focus.

00:22:40.471 --> 00:22:44.805
Movie topics can range from cinematography, character development, all the way to villains and themes.

00:22:44.805 --> 00:22:48.541
Good rating this week brash, cowabunga, cowabunga man.

00:22:48.541 --> 00:22:51.409
And then bad rating is late pizza, never pay for late pizza.

00:22:51.409 --> 00:22:54.116
Let's generate our first real deal segment, remembering that good rating is cowabunga, then bad rating is late pizza, never pay for late pizza.

00:22:54.116 --> 00:22:57.248
Let's generate our first real deal segment, remembering that good rating is cowabunga and bad rating is late pizza.

00:22:57.248 --> 00:22:57.608
All right.

00:22:57.608 --> 00:22:59.207
So our first one is the dialogue.

00:22:59.207 --> 00:23:01.005
I might start with the dialogue here.

00:23:01.005 --> 00:23:04.167
Brash, this is probably my least favorite aspect of the film.

00:23:04.167 --> 00:23:05.960
Same yeah, and the.

00:23:05.960 --> 00:23:10.845
You know the dialogue, I know, but do you think that's because we're out of time in this.

00:23:11.665 --> 00:23:15.169
Well not really because I sort of grew up on this.

00:23:15.169 --> 00:23:22.415
Realistically it is a little bit before us because we were born in 1990 when it came out.

00:23:22.415 --> 00:23:29.675
But I grew up on an old 87 cartoon.

00:23:34.579 --> 00:23:35.182
And I found some of the lines.

00:23:35.182 --> 00:23:36.183
Just one one is, yeah, quite fit.

00:23:36.183 --> 00:23:42.807
Yeah, they're overly over exaggerated and obviously trying to pay on that, that teenage sort of surfer vibe that's made famous by the ninja turtles cartoon in 87.

00:23:42.807 --> 00:23:45.500
And you know, I don't think it's.

00:23:45.500 --> 00:23:50.211
It doesn't feel organic, which is funny to say about teenage mutant ninja turtles.

00:23:50.211 --> 00:23:52.909
But you want the dialogue to flow and tell a story and feel organic.

00:23:52.909 --> 00:24:00.771
But a lot of the one-liners were put in there for either comedic effect or to show that like radical sort of language that these people use.

00:24:01.582 --> 00:24:03.027
I remember because I got most of it.

00:24:03.027 --> 00:24:12.614
But I remember there was like one scene at the farmhouse and I think it's either Mikey, I think it was Mikey said a joke and so everyone was sort of like smoking and giving it a night.

00:24:12.614 --> 00:24:13.400
I'm like I get it.

00:24:14.501 --> 00:24:21.672
Yeah, that's my fear about a lot of the movies that are coming out now that are having pop culture references that are relevant to the audience today.

00:24:21.672 --> 00:24:26.473
When you're talking about the way that they hold up in 35 years' time, obviously there's jokes that they make about.

00:24:26.473 --> 00:24:29.288
I think it's Chaney was one of the impressions that Mikey did.

00:24:29.288 --> 00:24:34.875
That's probably absolutely hilarious in the 90s.

00:24:34.875 --> 00:24:35.238
That's lost on me.

00:24:35.238 --> 00:24:47.911
And then some of the you can tell it's sort of geared towards adult, because when they're talking about April and Casey's romance he says you know, see, it's exactly like Moonlighting, which is a TV show that was around during the 90s starring Bruce Willis.

00:24:47.911 --> 00:24:49.742
It was like a romantic TV show.

00:24:49.742 --> 00:24:50.103
That's the line.

00:24:50.103 --> 00:24:50.984
I didn't get the Moonlighting one.

00:24:51.005 --> 00:24:53.852
The Moonlighting one, I was like a, like a romantic TV show, that's the line.

00:24:53.852 --> 00:24:54.713
I didn't get the moonlighting one.

00:24:54.713 --> 00:24:58.003
The moonlighting one, I was like, sorry, moonlighting, I'm like I don't know.

00:24:58.003 --> 00:25:02.227
I didn't know about TV show until just now, but like moonlighting, I'm like moonlighting.

00:25:02.227 --> 00:25:06.516
It's just like working a separate job at night time.

00:25:06.536 --> 00:25:09.301
Yeah, yeah yeah, it's a TV show, that's the thing.

00:25:09.301 --> 00:25:09.782
That's what I mean.

00:25:09.782 --> 00:25:13.332
Like there's a lot of 90s references in it, but I'm sure it was good at the time.

00:25:13.420 --> 00:25:14.961
What I heard was moonlighting as in.

00:25:14.961 --> 00:25:15.762
Moonlighting as in.

00:25:15.762 --> 00:25:18.229
You do a second job after your job at nighttime.

00:25:18.409 --> 00:25:36.333
But then you know, on the flip side of that they had some of that like one liners and now out of date 90s pop culture references, but then, through the middle act, dove into these elements of exposition Like she was writing a journal in her 12th grade formal, you know, the turtles are feeling so remorse.

00:25:36.333 --> 00:25:42.532
They are four again, but not full and all that kind of stuff.

00:25:42.532 --> 00:25:49.167
Like you know, it goes from that like tubular and excellent and all this teenage sort of stuff, and then it gets to To like old English Overly expository from April.

00:25:49.720 --> 00:25:58.987
Old English ink and quill writing and it's almost like you know they are specifically doing that so we can get the exposition that we need, which doesn't feel natural in a story like this.

00:25:59.127 --> 00:26:05.564
Yeah, so when they had Splinter talking to the young kid, that was great because it was.

00:26:05.584 --> 00:26:11.106
Master Splinter sharing wisdom, all fathers love their children, or something like that.

00:26:11.588 --> 00:26:18.691
And he's talking to me and when he comes back there the second time and he actually starts talking about the turtles and everything like that.

00:26:19.071 --> 00:26:25.569
Yeah, that's the beauty of Master Splinter in this one Splinter, Master Splinter, even though he looks oh yeah.

00:26:26.300 --> 00:26:28.766
Like we talked about the turtles being kind of uncanny, he looks like he's been through it.

00:26:29.359 --> 00:26:35.132
I do like that about this movie, though, that I do like that about this movie, though, that he looks a little bit different and he looks like he's been through it and he's got that wet appearance all the time like a sewer rat.

00:26:35.152 --> 00:26:41.191
I love that, um, but one thing about Splinter a Splinter character in a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles always has to be wise and warm.

00:26:41.191 --> 00:26:48.628
They're my two musts, for Splinter has to be wise and he has to be warm Not warm as in a warm hug and caring.

00:26:48.628 --> 00:26:55.016
And when he's going through that dialogue with Danny, I think, because he's that kind of mentor, he's warm and he's he's, you know, wise.

00:26:55.016 --> 00:26:59.250
It comes off as like a natural conversational teaching moment because it fits the character.

00:26:59.471 --> 00:27:05.842
Yeah, it's the same when he's talking to April, yep, when April first wakes up and he's able to calm her down and and Raphael as well.

00:27:05.882 --> 00:27:09.646
After he comes back he's beat down with with Casey Jones.

00:27:09.646 --> 00:27:15.295
He sort of talks to him and then you know you go into the origin story with the he's like I lost my side and he's like let it go let it go.

00:27:15.454 --> 00:27:18.446
Yeah, it's fine, we'll get another one, yeah chill.

00:27:18.768 --> 00:27:19.309
Yeah, he's always.

00:27:19.309 --> 00:27:20.752
He's always that way inclined.

00:27:20.752 --> 00:27:26.984
But I feel like the dialogue with Splinter was good, but yeah, for me this is a bad.

00:27:26.984 --> 00:27:27.326
This is.

00:27:27.645 --> 00:27:37.571
I have to agree, late pizza, like some of the lines were really cool, like the initial, like the first time where they're like, where Donnie's trying to fit in, excellent, excellent.

00:27:37.839 --> 00:27:39.125
I think that was a Bill and Ted reference.

00:27:39.125 --> 00:27:39.627
Yeah, yeah.

00:27:39.667 --> 00:28:08.970
Yeah, and like that, like that whole, that whole sort of first part I thought was really good, them getting the pizza or anything, I thought that whole into the actual movie and then had to add context for the movie is where I think they slipped, because they're trying to add context to like the because it's such a dark movie, which I don't like, which is, I think, another reason why the dialogue failed is because it's such a dark, heavy movie, although I think the director sort of leaned it towards that way.

00:28:10.059 --> 00:28:25.842
But then you've got these lighthearted characters that are all like surfy and yeah, mikey never really pulled out of the, the um, he never pulled out of the like the, the campy, quippy comic relief dialogue you know like, and that's and and the whole movie turned dark and serious.

00:28:26.262 --> 00:28:55.440
And then you got these teenagers that are still trying to be teenagerish and they're trying to make, they're trying to explain all these serious events that are happening and about their father figure and mentor possibly being dead or murdered or taken and they're all losing hope and everything like that, and this just doesn't quite translate because they're still making jokes over April and you know la laing at her and yeah, and the only serious scenes you have is like the bomb fire, like the campfire scene, when they were like do you see the turtles?

00:28:56.323 --> 00:29:00.468
the tears, tears and you know, someone queued the dropper on that one.

00:29:00.468 --> 00:29:03.306
It's just like cue the dropper it's like tears.

00:29:03.666 --> 00:29:19.971
But then you look at their faces and they still look like horrifyingly fucking happy yeah, because there's must be a sad function on the animatronics the only reason why you can probably tell they're sad is because they're going and then there's like a teardrop and you're like, oh, they're sad.

00:29:19.971 --> 00:29:23.170
If they didn't have that tear, I would have noticed.

00:29:24.085 --> 00:29:25.373
Alright, so you're writing a bad pizza.

00:29:25.373 --> 00:29:26.640
Bad pizza, alright, sweet.

00:29:26.640 --> 00:29:28.307
Bad pizza for the dialogue.

00:29:28.307 --> 00:29:29.801
Let's get our next one for our real deal segment.

00:29:29.801 --> 00:29:33.188
All right, our next one that we have generated is the action sequences.

00:29:33.188 --> 00:29:38.605
So this is where we're talking about, like practical stunts and the the martial arts sections of the movie.

00:29:38.605 --> 00:29:51.847
I think I read somewhere that the martial arts sections were all performed by the stuntmen, in the suits, obviously, and they filmed it at a slower speed and filmed it up, so it looked like you can tell a movie faster?

00:29:51.867 --> 00:29:52.910
yeah, in a few a few of the scenes.

00:29:52.930 --> 00:30:01.368
Yeah, in a few of the scenes you could definitely tell, especially one where Donatello was in the antique store and spitting on his shell and knocking people over, and another one when they were doing a lot of the roundhouse kicks.

00:30:01.368 --> 00:30:03.047
You could definitely tell that they were sped up as well.

00:30:03.047 --> 00:30:14.053
That being said, these suits I believe they made a secondary more fluidly and as a result of that, they were able to get some of the combat scenes off.

00:30:14.053 --> 00:30:24.808
One thing I did like about it is sometimes in a low budget movie you don't see a lot of people fighting on the screen at once, whereas in this one we got some pull away shots where we got to see a lot of the turtles fighting shell to shell.

00:30:24.808 --> 00:30:32.528
You got a different sort of view on various different settings and scenes where you could see different parts of the fights happening in different areas and times.

00:30:33.329 --> 00:30:42.752
I have a real soft spot for this kind of combat style because it reminds me of the early Power Rangers stuff, which I absolutely loved, and the early Power Rangers movie, which I loved as well.

00:30:42.752 --> 00:30:46.490
So I think for me they're slower, they're exaggerated.

00:30:46.490 --> 00:30:50.892
I'm probably going to give this a cowabunga with a smell of late pizza for me.

00:30:50.892 --> 00:30:52.844
I think there were some good elements and some bad elements.

00:30:52.844 --> 00:30:54.487
I think there were some good elements and some bad elements.

00:30:54.487 --> 00:30:55.971
I think that overcame a lot of the like.

00:30:55.990 --> 00:30:57.232
The fight choreography was good.

00:30:57.232 --> 00:31:04.671
I think they overcame a lot of the technical aspects of having to fight in these cumbersome objects that they were using to to make it look like you know.

00:31:04.671 --> 00:31:05.472
That were okay.

00:31:05.472 --> 00:31:26.148
My biggest pet peeve with it was I was waiting for the end scene where they're facing the shredder, for the end scene where they're facing the Shredder, where the Turtles all learn that they're stronger together, because that's Splinter's ultimate lesson they're stronger together when they fight as a team, and then you know they go at him one by one one at a time one in, one in, and then you know, eventually it's Splinter that comes and saves the day.

00:31:26.647 --> 00:31:29.463
I think it would have been better for me as a moral kind of lesson.

00:31:29.463 --> 00:31:36.125
If they all sort of, I'll say, jumped him, it's not very honorable, but there's four on one and they fight better as a family.

00:31:36.125 --> 00:31:37.491
So I would have loved to see that, but I didn't.

00:31:37.491 --> 00:31:40.945
So for me it's a cowabunga with a hint of late pizza.

00:31:40.945 --> 00:31:41.387
What about you?

00:31:42.160 --> 00:31:47.144
So I agree with everything you said, and especially the Power Rangers thing.

00:31:47.144 --> 00:31:54.374
Like I sort of like, oh, this kicks, they miss punches, and then the bad guys like their punches going past and then they're like a split second later they're like, oh, I got hit.

00:31:54.374 --> 00:31:57.557
And then they do the whole twisted move and jump out of the way thing which is hit.

00:31:57.557 --> 00:32:08.685
Like watching it I was like, yeah, but for me I have to actually give you a bad pizza, you mean a late pizza there's no bad pizza just late pizza that chubbies for me.

00:32:08.926 --> 00:32:15.685
Yeah, I have to agree with what a lot of the critics said about it, that there was too much violence in it.

00:32:15.685 --> 00:33:02.989
Instead of them taking on 20 people in this crowded room with those four turtles in those suits, just have I don't know five, six and actually have a combat instead of just a mishmash of just random making a swing and then someone's like just someone being there and having to jump out of the way saying thinking they got hit, like instead of that, like if they were more focused and because like you got tatsu, like tatsu is like one of their big henchmen, having like a one-on-one with him or like a one having like, even even having like, say, tatsu and two others that are similar strength to Tatsu in a way, and having those three fight the Turtles in more of a personal fight, I think would have been more beneficial.

00:33:03.240 --> 00:33:07.367
Or even just a Raph and Tatsu showdown, which then led to him being thrown through the roof.

00:33:07.367 --> 00:33:11.411
Even that would have been good, instead of him being jumped by 10 to 12 foot ninjas.

00:33:12.142 --> 00:33:19.960
But that fight I didn't really mind that much because there was the one turtle against a lot of guys, and that, not for me, is fine.

00:33:19.960 --> 00:33:30.779
But when they had all four trying to maneuver, though, especially when they're inside the building trying to maneuver all those guys around in that one space, it just become cluttered and claustrophobic.

00:33:30.779 --> 00:33:41.986
You could, you could see more, the more prominently you could see the power rangers fighting, where you could tell that he kicked and was nowhere near the bad guy and the bad guy went flying.

00:33:41.986 --> 00:33:45.017
It was just so prominent, I think from back back though.

00:33:45.017 --> 00:33:48.469
Back then, though, that was probably more, I think that was normalized.

00:33:48.509 --> 00:33:49.652
Yeah, that was the way it was.

00:33:49.652 --> 00:33:59.646
And you know, the foot, the foot, ninjas seemed to be ineffective and almost like laughable in the fact that we're calling these things ninjas and they're literally running towards turtles and getting kicked away.

00:33:59.646 --> 00:34:01.446
It was more for the effect of it, I'd say.

00:34:01.901 --> 00:34:13.971
And they're meant to be all like trains by Shredder and Tatsu, and for them to actually wear the mask, they have to pass a certain sort of like, sort of like your belt grade Initiation yeah.

00:34:13.971 --> 00:34:19.568
So they've gone from like being the white belt all the way to black belt, to the white with yellow tips.

00:34:19.708 --> 00:34:28.208
Yeah, they're like meant to have gone to like from being just kids on the street white belts to black belt ninjas and they're pretty much just all useless.

00:34:28.208 --> 00:34:31.987
Like the putty men from ninjas from, like the putty men from from uh, perringers.

00:34:31.987 --> 00:34:34.351
But, um, yeah, no, for me.

00:34:34.351 --> 00:34:38.518
I I didn't like, I think for the combat scenes.

00:34:38.518 --> 00:34:45.266
I sort of fast forwarded through the well, the combat because I was like eh, boring the combat scenes in a movie.

00:34:45.286 --> 00:34:56.280
You really want to build tension yeah so you want them to sort of right ebb and flow in in tension until it gets to a sort of critical mass point, and I don't think these fights were really choreographed in that way to do that story wise.

00:34:56.280 --> 00:35:06.722
I think they were choreographed to show flips and kicks and awesome stuff which is very reminiscent of hong kong cinema, martial arts movies, which is what this was funded and backed by as well, and they're always trying to like.

00:35:06.742 --> 00:35:09.487
They're always saying quips and one-liners throughout the fights.

00:35:09.487 --> 00:35:10.108
That's a comic comic book.

00:35:10.128 --> 00:35:10.309
Thing.

00:35:10.608 --> 00:35:27.226
Yeah, but the thing is it was so drowned out from the actual amount of shit going on on the screen that I couldn't even tell you one clip that they came up with when they're fighting, because all it was it was just an overload of just people on the screen randomly getting flung around everywhere.

00:35:27.226 --> 00:35:29.420
And then one of the guys would say something like what did you say?

00:35:29.420 --> 00:35:44.523
And like it just drowned out with all like the other, like all the music, the fighting effects and the fighting noises, yeah, it all sort of just drowns out like a mishmash of various different elements which really left the combat feeling ineffective is what you're saying, pretty much.

00:35:44.603 --> 00:35:50.746
Or in other words, late pizza, late pizza, yeah, okay, all right, so for the next one let's get it up.

00:35:50.746 --> 00:35:53.331
And the next one that we have up is the tone of the movie.

00:35:53.331 --> 00:35:55.648
So the word unique comes to mind for me.

00:35:55.648 --> 00:36:00.552
So they obviously had two different IPs to draw from when they were making this movie.

00:36:00.552 --> 00:36:07.271
They had the 1987 cartoon and they had the comic books and they're completely different tonally to each other.

00:36:07.760 --> 00:36:34.721
And I think Steve Barron, when he was directing this, obviously wanted to do a darker element to this movie in terms of the dark themes in this movie where there is elements of torture, there's kids smoking, it's basically showing a predatory kind of figure creating a gang out of wayward teens, which is also not so nice tonally uh, not not so nice tonally.

00:36:34.721 --> 00:36:35.804
There is street crime and all that kind of thing.

00:36:35.804 --> 00:36:38.148
That really points to this sort of darker, darker vibe which is very reminiscent of the comics.

00:36:38.148 --> 00:36:43.309
But then there are those adult comic book readers that would want to go and see this movie.

00:36:43.309 --> 00:36:49.846
But then the most successful thing about the teenage mutant ninja turtles was obviously the cartoon in the toy line which was making lots, of, lots of money.

00:36:49.846 --> 00:36:55.188
So the kids were also a bit of a pull and an audience to come to this Ninja Turtles movie.

00:36:55.188 --> 00:37:01.248
So totally, if you're trying to make this, you're going to disappoint either one or the other, and I think Steve Barron tried to get the best of both worlds in this.

00:37:01.248 --> 00:37:02.726
He tried to mesh both of them together.

00:37:03.342 --> 00:37:05.340
And that doesn't usually work out too well.

00:37:05.340 --> 00:37:13.849
It doesn't usually work out too well, so you usually get the people who love the darker, grittier elements of it and then the people who love the comedic sort of slapstick moments of it.

00:37:13.849 --> 00:37:18.735
I think this one, I think it does it okay in terms of meshing those two things together.

00:37:19.559 --> 00:37:20.822
What are your thoughts?

00:37:20.822 --> 00:37:24.452
I don't mind the kids smoking paying billions.

00:37:24.452 --> 00:37:28.860
It's a very Pinocchio themed sort of thing and I thought that was fine.

00:37:28.860 --> 00:37:33.039
I thought that was the whole thing of like come, children come children, you can do all this.

00:37:33.059 --> 00:37:36.085
Yeah, enticing Adults stuff, drink, beer, smoke do whatever you want.

00:37:36.106 --> 00:37:37.329
Yeah, you're free to do whatever you want.

00:37:37.329 --> 00:37:38.190
Your parents hate you.

00:37:38.190 --> 00:37:38.992
We love you.

00:37:38.992 --> 00:37:41.164