April 16, 2025

New Mutants (2020) - Are Horror and Superheroes a Perfect Match? Transformation through Connection with the New Mutants

Aaron and Brash explore how Josh Boone's horror-inspired X-Men film New Mutants stands as a fascinating anomaly in superhero cinema. A psychological horror film disguised as an X-Men movie that dares to explore the trauma and isolation inherent in discovering you're different. Unlike most superhero fare, this final entry in Fox's X-Men franchise eschews world-ending stakes for something far more intimate and chilling.

Topics:
Director Josh Boone, a passionate fan of the source material, crafts a story that feels more Stephen King than Stan Lee, drawing heavily from the iconic Demon Bear saga while incorporating influences from horror classics like Nightmare on Elm Street and The Shining. The film follows five young mutants trapped in a mysterious facility, each confronting their powers and personal demons while forming bonds that ultimately save them.

What makes this film special is how it returns to the core themes that made X-Men comics revolutionary – using mutation as a metaphor for adolescence, trauma, and found family. Through characters like Danny Moonstar (Blue Hunt) and Illyana Rasputin (Anya Taylor-Joy), we see how powers emerge from trauma, how fear can manifest physically, and how connection becomes essential for survival.

Despite production challenges and pandemic-related delays that prevented planned reshoots and sequels, The New Mutants remains a bold experiment in superhero storytelling.

Ready to discover a different kind of superhero story? Join us as we explore how The New Mutants bridges horror and heroism in ways that make it one of the most distinctive entries in Marvel's cinematic universe.

Key Takeaways:

• The New Mutants serves as the final film in Fox's X-Men universe, blending psychological horror with superhero elements
• Director Josh Boone, a major fan of the comics, draws heavily from the iconic Demon Bear saga
• The film features strong horror influences from Nightmare on Elm Street, The Shining, and One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest
• Production challenges included Disney's acquisition of Fox and the COVID-19 pandemic, delaying release from 2018 to 2020
• Anya Taylor-Joy's portrayal of Magic/Illyana Rasputin stands out as particularly faithful to the comics
• John Hamm was originally cast as Mr. Sinister but his scenes were cut from the final version
• The movie explores themes of friendship, trauma, and identity – core elements of X-Men storytelling often overlooked in previous films

Apple Podcast Tags:

NewMutants, MarvelMovies, XMenUniverse, DemonBearSaga, JoshBoone, Magik, DaniMoonstar, MCU, MarvelCinematicUniverse, MutantMayhem, ComicBookMovies, FandomPortalsPodcast, GeekFreaksNetwork, MovieBreakdown, MarvelHorror

Instagram: instagram.com/fandomportals/?locale=en
Threads: threads.net/@fandomportals
Email: fandomportals@gmail.com
Letterboxd: https://letterboxd.com/fandomportals

16:27 - Fandom Facts Face-Off Begins

25:06 - Introduction to The New Mutants

35:06 - Set Secrets and Horror Influences

01:22:06 - Character Spotlight: Magic and Danny

01:26:17 - Most Valuable Takeawy, Friendship and the Feeling of being an outsider

01:31:23 - Rating it and ranking it!

WEBVTT

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Mr Sinister was actually going to be in the movie.

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Do you know who he's going to portray?

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I do and I actually think it's awesome.

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It is awesome, I think it would be such a good casting.

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Welcome to the Fandom Portals podcast, the podcast that explores how fandoms can help us learn and grow.

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This week, we looked at the New Mutants from 2020, and I'm joined as always by Mr Adam Brasher, or, as we like to call him, brash.

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How are you going Brash?

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Too bad yourself?

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Oh, mate, I'm going pretty good, not too bad at all.

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The New Mutants 2020,.

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It was made well.

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It was released.

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That's another story, but we picked this one as part of our Marvel month.

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It's the second one so far of our Marvel month.

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We have already done an episode on the Fantastic Four and this is the second installment for our Marvel month of April.

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It's the 13th Fox movie in the X-Men universe and it was the last one to be released by Fox.

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It's a psychological, horror and superhero movie.

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In this episode, you guys are going to look at and learn about how classic horror films influenced the chilling tone of the New Mutants, how director Josh Boone adapted the iconic Marvel Demon Bear saga for the big screen, how characters like Danny, moonstar and Magic were portrayed and whether they lived up to their comic book roots, and how production nightmares and the pandemic turned a promising franchise starter to a box office blob Brash.

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This movie is about five young mutants just discovering their abilities.

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While held in a secret facility against their will, they fight to escape their past sins and save themselves.

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You know who directs this movie, brash?

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Yes, that would be Josh Boone.

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Yes, it is Josh Boone.

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And yes, it is Josh Boone and it's also written by Josh Boone and his best friend, nate Lee.

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Big fan, big fan.

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Josh Boone.

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He's a big fan of the Marvel comics.

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He actually is.

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Yeah, and that shows through this whole movie him and Nate Lee big fans of the New Mutants as they sort of arrived around the 80s and 90s and that sort of era Got a couple of stars in this young budding stars.

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One of them that I enjoyed watching was Charlie Heaton, the mayor himself from Stranger Things.

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He plays Sam Guthrie as Cannibal.

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Who are some people that you like to watch in this one Brash?

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Oh, annette Taylor-Joy.

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She's always a joy to watch, absolutely Like her new movie on Apple Plus.

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The Gorge is also Love that movie, yeah, not too bad.

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And then obviously she gained fame from the Queen's Gambit and she plays Also in our series.

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Yeah, yeah, ileana Rasputin in this one, and we've got Maisie Williams as well, who was obviously In Benethrones.

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She was Arya Stark.

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She can't escape that wolf vibe, can she?

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No, she does a really good job she does in this one.

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Yeah, she plays Rain Sinclair, who is obviously Wolf's bane from the New Mutants.

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She is kind of like the heart of this movie.

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I would say she's the one all the teen inmates slash patients gather around.

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You might say, yeah, all right, brash, do you know how much this movie was made for Budget?

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I'm going to much.

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This movie was made for budget, I'm gonna guess I think 2020, five mil, no much more.

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67 million, 67.

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I didn't think that last far as it has a pretty significant cg in this movie, that would be a lot of money, yeah yeah.

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So 67 million is what it was made for and it actually only grossed 49.2 million.

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That's super unfortunate, yeah, super unfortunate.

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There's a couple of reasons for that we might get into in the podcast.

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But, brash, here's a little of reasons for that we might get into in the podcast.

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But, brash, here's a little fun fact for you.

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Before we get into our fandom facts, face-off in our first pre-facts.

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A pre-fact, you might say Did you know?

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A lot of people are on the fence, you might say, about this movie, the New Means, but it was actually nominated for an award and it wasn't a Razzie.

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It was actually nominated for the best comic book to film motion picture adaptation for 2020.

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To be fair, it is extremely accurate because Josh Broon obviously was a huge fan.

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Exactly right.

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It is very accurate to the Demon Bear saga, which we'll also be going into in today's episode.

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The other nominees for this award in 2021 was Bloodshot with Vin Diesel, Birds of Prey with Margot Robbie and the Joker.

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So they didn't win because obviously the Joker won it, but it is interesting to know that the New Means was in fact, nominated for an award which, yeah, very interesting.

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Alright, let's dive into our First Takes segment.

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Alright, this is our First Takes segment.

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This is where we discuss our first thoughts of the media and unpack the boldest opinions, from what surprised us to what split the room.

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We'll also highlight your hot takes from our threads, Instagram and Reddit community.

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So if you wanted to get involved in that, make sure you check out the show notes below.

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All our social links are there and we read out a lot of the comments that we get on our podcast.

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So, Brash, you selected this movie the new moon so obviously you'd seen it and you had some opinions about it uh.

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So I was so excited originally when this movie was announced because it was going to be that full horror like it was going to like pretty much direct from the comics.

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It was going to be a lot darker that I think they've lightened it from what the comics sort of were overall still like it still had that sort of horrorish theme, but, um, I still think it was still rated PG, I think, wasn't it?

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Yeah, it was PG-13.

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Pg-13, which I was still a little bit surprised about, because they have certain themes in there that I thought would probably make it that sort of M rating.

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But I also because one of my favorite Marvel characters, maybe even just one of my favorite mutant Marvel characters is magic, and when I heard that she was going to be in it.

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I was like hell, yeah, yeah.

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And might I just say they could not have cast her better.

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In my opinion, looks wise the way that she was portrayed and in Taylor, joy did a fantastic job playing Ileana Aspudin 100%, yeah, I really hope she does come back in some capacity, just even as a cameo.

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I think she was the shining star of this movie, but I was the same.

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I found that this movie wasn't really my cup of tea, as is very well documented on this podcast.

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I'm not a horror guy.

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I find them very, very scary.

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If it had been I mean really one of them you might not be able to get through it.

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Yeah, yeah, that's it.

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But you know, apparently Boone designed this film as a psychological horror movie.

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So it explores like trauma and isolation, and the kids in the movie are finding their identity which is literally what X-Men characters in the comic books are all about through the most traumatic moments of their life during the X-Men comic books, because they are navigating through their mutations which is obviously a stand-in for puberty as well and all of the different things that are happening to your body at the time and all of the different social connections that you gain and lose during that time.

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So this movie does a really good job of actually highlighting that as a primary theme in X-Men comics, which doesn't really happen a lot in superhero movies, but it especially doesn't happen in the old x-men uh movies, the ones that start like hugh jackman and james marsden, things like that.

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They kind of skip that entire aspect of the x-men and go more for, like the, the found family team of mutants with abilities, action, superheroes blasting blah, blah, that kind of thing, but they never really explore the characters, which is what I really liked about this movie is that they actually dove into who these people were maybe not to the full extent that some people would have liked, but you were able to see some of those, you know, emphasizing some of the lower sort of consequences of an X-Men movie.

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So it was actually said as well that in this movie the kids in the movie were able to talk to each other in ways that mutants in other X-Men movies didn't really talk to each other in that manner, you know.

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They were actually talking to each other as teenagers, especially during the attic scene that we saw.

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So for me, that was the thing that stood out to me the most.

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That was my hot take is that this actually looked at that exploration of trauma, isolation and identity, where the characters could actually explore this mutation that's happening to them, which would be traumatic.

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So that explore this mutation that's happening to them, which would be traumatic.

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So that was that was my big take, and I like how um they used um the character of dr alice played by alicia braga.

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Um alice braga, sorry um to be sort of like the doctor slash, the psychiatrist person there and which helped like and that helps to is like, instead of just having the kids in this sort of like makeshift xavier school to move on to the next place, it's more of an explorer.

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It helps the narrative to explore each of their traumas.

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Yeah, the mysterious element that she adds is really good because if you're a fan of the comic book, you obviously know the ins and outs of the Essex Corporation and Charles Xavier and the kind of hints that they were dropping through the middle of the movie there with Dr Reyes.

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But it's also important to note that Dr Reyes in the comic books is actually like a good guy.

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She plays Forcefield or she's Forcefield, a mutant who's able to develop Forcefield, and she's also a very prominent doctor.

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So having her in there and the constant references to Charles Xavier was purposeful misdirection and you know what it actually worked on me.

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I'm I'm like a, an avid x-men fan and I knew that this was about like some sort of horror elements and nothing was really as it seemed.

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But it still worked on me because I knew that those characters, I knew who they were and as a result of that, I trusted them because they were x-men that I knew and trusted.

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So I think that the you know, josh boone leaned into that, being a comic book fan himself, knowing that the people that were actually watching this movie as comic book fans, especially fans of the demon bear saga from 1982 would really appreciate the changes that he made and to this movie and the way that, um, like people who are like, oh, but she's a good guy the way he could get around.

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that is because of her employer who has, who has, in fact, many times cloned and copied and made copies of other myths, so she may not even be the real Alice Reyes.

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Exactly right and the pin that is on her lapel all the time that you can see.

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That is something that Mr Sinister usually gives to somebody or it's on their body somewhere in the comic books if they're being controlled by, manipulated, or is a clone of somebody made by Mr Sinister, also known as Nathaniel Essex.

00:09:51.073 --> 00:09:55.931
So, yeah, lots of things to really enjoy in this movie.

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What did you think of the blend of genres, Brash, if we're talking about psychological horror and the superhero genre, because I know for some people it was very controversial because it wasn't what they were expecting, and for others it was a breath of fresh air.

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What were your thoughts?

00:10:09.125 --> 00:10:10.552
oh, I, I really loved it.

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That's why I was really hoping for a more darker.

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I was hoping for that more because when, like it was first dance, because then they had to stop production and pretty much redo nearly the whole time movie because I had to make it less bright, which was a little bit sad.

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But I I was so excited because if you're like, look at some of the comics like they are quite they can be quite dark.

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Oh yeah, especially the new mutants run.

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The new mutants run, which was um, primarily written by chris claremont and pencils and inks done by bill sinkowitz.

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They were the flagship comic, that sort of sped off from the x-men, where they were able to just try new things.

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So the x-men was always where they would sort of keep it a little bit safe and do all of the x-men things that everybody was expecting.

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And the new mutants was that spin-off where they could say, okay, we're gonna, we're gonna send them to space and they're gonna meet a extraterrestrial alien called warlock.

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In this episode they're gonna fight a like a spiritual bear, like they literally just threw things at the audience just to see what stuck, just to see what they could do.

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And that kind of creative freedom for Chris Claremont and Bill Sinkowitz, who was the artist, was really it was just emboldening for them.

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And Bill Sinkowitz is an actual massive fan of the Demon Bear saga.

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He's the one that drew issue 18, 19, and 20.

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If you haven't read it, I recommend you and and pick up a copy of it because just for the art style like it's, it was a tonal change at the time and there was just these visceral ink, heavy, impressionistic, vibrant uses of colors.

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It was juxtaposed with this heavy black and it really sort of had these heavy art lines that showed it was almost like someone was psychotic drawing these pictures, showing these these controversial sort of like realism was was out the window when it came to these comic books and it was like an exaggeration of everything in terms of he used character size, for example, he would draw the sizes of the character in a manner that would show how powerful they were to the audience as opposed to them saying it in dialogue.

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And for him to be paired with Chris Claremont was really interesting because he's a very impressionistic artist and Chris Claremont is a very literal and lore heavy comic writer.

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So that pairing together worked really well for the New Mutants and when we're talking about this Demon Bear saga, I think they adapted it really well also.

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So I think that a horror superhero movie for the New Mutants was a perfect fit.

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And when Bill Sinkowitz actually came on as a creative consultant and he looked and talked to Josh Boone, he said, oh, this guy actually gets it.

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He knows what we're going to try and do when we're going to make a New Mutants comic book.

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Back in the 80s we actually were trying to go with this kind of horror vibe.

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The fact that they wanted to get a darker psychological horror and with the superpowers, and I think, think, like I know some people don't like that blend, but I think that blends perfect, because you've got kids who don't understand their powers, don't understand what's happening to them.

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It would be a terrifying thing and, like you see, in like all your yeah, like all the other movies that you see, you've got the x-men that it's a bit more, it's always a bit more lighter and fluffier and more fantastical, whereas in reality, like not being able to touch anyone or fear of just considering them unless you're a psychopath, would be a fine, terrifying.

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And that's why I think it was a shame that I wasn't allowed to go sort of that darker path because, like for me, it was like I don't mind horror, I like a bit of horror, and everything was sort of like for me, just like on the edge of being awesome.

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But it was like I don't mind horror, I like a bit of horror, and everything was sort of like for me, just like on the edge of being awesome, but it was just just that tone down, that enough that I was just like, ah, it's like almost horror enough for me, but it just yeah, never quite got there and that's probably why a lot of the characters didn't get the full expose of who they are, because they couldn't go that dark and and like that was a lot of the.

00:13:47.142 --> 00:14:03.015
What people didn't like was the fact that it didn't quite explore fully all the characters, but to be fair, they couldn't because they didn't let them go as dark as they probably could have yeah, I agree, yeah, it's, it's never fully expressed for us as well.

00:14:03.076 --> 00:14:24.572
And you know, I I watched a couple of interviews with with josh boone and and they said you know they did want to explore this horror and suspense-borne, psychological thriller kind of element of the X-Men, because a lot of the other X-Men movies were very operatic, so they were grand, like you were saying, and they usually had like global consequences.

00:14:24.572 --> 00:14:27.044
If they weren't going to stop the phoenix force, the literal world would end.

00:14:27.044 --> 00:14:37.240
But this sort of drilled it right down to what happens to an individual when the thing about them that they thought was true is utterly changed.

00:14:37.240 --> 00:14:58.090
And that is very compelling to watch when you've got five of these characters that are going through this same sort of change and trauma and they're bonding together to try and get through it, which I think he said it was a mix of Stephen King and John Hughes, which I think is perfectly describing what this movie is and what the New Mutants kind of tone was.

00:14:58.090 --> 00:15:05.207
So Nate Lee actually said something very poignant and perfect I think, when he was referring to this movie.

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He said a lot of X-Men movies are very grandiose but what they wanted to do with this movie, the New Mutants was to let it be what it is, and that was a no-costume, no-supervillain, character-driven, psychological, horror-filled movie and in my opinion, I think they pulled that off as best they could in the situation that they had, because they did have some challenges as well, which we'll probably get into a little bit later in the pod.

00:15:30.563 --> 00:15:34.600
All right, shall we get into our community's thoughts on this movie.

00:15:34.600 --> 00:15:36.504
Brash Sure, yes, okay.

00:15:36.544 --> 00:15:40.341
So on our Reddit our Reddit was a little bit quieter on this movie.

00:15:40.341 --> 00:15:43.648
For this one we had a couple of people commenting.

00:15:43.648 --> 00:15:55.565
We have Mickey Flynn on our Reddits that says it was great, and we also have Jugoso2014 says that I liked it better than the last two X-Men movies, but that's not saying much.

00:15:55.565 --> 00:15:57.750
They're not very positive on the Reddit front.

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On our threads, we have Dadstunich that says magic was actually awesome and hopes she comes back into the MCU.

00:16:04.110 --> 00:16:05.433
They highly doubt it.

00:16:05.433 --> 00:16:10.785
Bobby Reads Comics says they did Cecilia Reyes dirty, like they didn't even cast an actor.

00:16:10.785 --> 00:16:19.547
That was the right skin tone, and I know that there was a couple of different comments regarding Roberto's casting, sunspot's casting as well, so that was something that sort of surrounded the film.

00:16:19.547 --> 00:16:28.914
Also, we have Dashiell2077 that says Anya Taylor-Joy was given I'm not Russian and I'm no ear for accents at all.

00:16:28.914 --> 00:16:32.250
Note perfect as Ileana Rasputin, I agree.

00:16:32.250 --> 00:16:33.885
I think she was actually perfectly casted.

00:16:33.885 --> 00:16:37.308
I think she did really well Because at the time, in 2017, she was actually very young.

00:16:37.308 --> 00:16:41.490
The movie being filmed in 2017 wasn't released until 2020.

00:16:41.490 --> 00:16:47.267
But at the time, she'd moved on to other projects before then and this was one of her first acting roles.

00:16:47.466 --> 00:16:49.173
We have the misanthrope.

00:16:49.173 --> 00:16:52.923
Runner says that it was forgettable and it felt like it was hacked up in the editing.

00:16:52.923 --> 00:16:58.964
And we also have walter paisley that says it was fun and the young cast were uniformly good.

00:16:58.964 --> 00:17:02.864
It's just another superhero movie, so fun is really all that is required.

00:17:02.864 --> 00:17:10.759
We also had samoliso, who is a regular commenter and also somebody who's requested some of our fandom portly as pics episodes.

00:17:10.759 --> 00:17:12.364
He says that it was fine.

00:17:12.364 --> 00:17:17.665
It was sad and didn't anticipate hearing wolf spade talking about masturbation, but that happened too.

00:17:17.665 --> 00:17:19.372
So, yeah, thank you, samoliso.

00:17:19.372 --> 00:17:25.500
Uh, so yeah, we've got some definite differences of opinions out there in our hot takes for our community, I remember.

00:17:25.500 --> 00:17:33.051
If you wanted to join in those and have them being read out on the pod as well, make sure you go to our socials in the show notes below and become a part of the Fandom Portals community.

00:17:33.051 --> 00:17:34.704
So I think it's safe to say Brash.

00:17:34.704 --> 00:17:36.851
It sounds to me like you enjoyed the film.

00:17:37.701 --> 00:17:38.766
I did, I very much did.

00:17:38.900 --> 00:17:39.362
And I did too.

00:17:39.362 --> 00:17:40.205
I think it was great.

00:17:40.205 --> 00:17:52.563
Let's jump into our fandom fact face-off.

00:17:52.563 --> 00:17:55.596
All right, this is where hosts go head-to-head with trivia about the focus media, learning new facts along the way.

00:17:55.596 --> 00:18:00.559
The host with the least points at the end of the month loses and has to take the winner to an all expenses paid trip to the movie.

00:18:00.559 --> 00:18:01.721
However, this month we're doing something different.

00:18:01.721 --> 00:18:02.412
This is a marvel team up, because it's marvel month.

00:18:02.412 --> 00:18:03.560
Hosts are teaming up to collect 15 points and send a lucky listener to the movies.

00:18:03.560 --> 00:18:04.611
However, this month we're doing something different.

00:18:04.611 --> 00:18:05.373
This is a Marvel team-up, because it's Marvel Month.

00:18:05.373 --> 00:18:09.304
Hosts are teaming up to collect 15 points and send a lucky listener to the movies.

00:18:09.304 --> 00:18:18.721
That giveaway is open for you right now and all you have to do is go to wwwfandomportalspodcastcom and join our emailing list and hope that we earn 15 points.

00:18:18.721 --> 00:18:19.442
Brash, do you remember?

00:18:19.442 --> 00:18:19.842
I?

00:18:20.583 --> 00:18:21.223
think we got to.

00:18:21.223 --> 00:18:23.306
It didn't quite get there, so we got five.

00:18:23.665 --> 00:18:24.106
We did.

00:18:24.106 --> 00:18:24.826
We got to five.

00:18:24.826 --> 00:18:30.932
We have the potential to get six per episode and we're doing four episodes, so potentially we have the points to get to 24.

00:18:30.932 --> 00:18:37.640
But last week we only got five, so hopefully this week we get some more for our lucky listeners to be going off to the movies.

00:18:37.640 --> 00:18:43.825
Remember, if you wanted to join that giveaway, go to wwwphantomportalspodcastcom and join our emailing list.

00:18:43.825 --> 00:18:46.347
All right, brash, you can go first with your question.

00:18:46.347 --> 00:18:47.689
What do you got for me?

00:18:48.329 --> 00:18:59.606
Okay, so the majority of this film was located at Medfield State Hospital in Massachusetts, and a lot of the cast and crew were unsettled by this.

00:18:59.606 --> 00:19:00.951
Why is?

00:19:01.010 --> 00:19:02.798
that I know the answer to this one.

00:19:02.798 --> 00:19:11.974
So the Medfield State Hospital was one of Massachusetts' first insane asylums in the area of Boston.

00:19:11.974 --> 00:19:19.273
Filming at the site was unsettling and crew members reported hearing strange noises and unexplained occurrences during the night shoots and things like that.

00:19:19.273 --> 00:19:26.413
It was also the set location for Shutter Island, martin Scorsese's film starring Leonardo DiCaprio, mark Ruffalo.

00:19:26.413 --> 00:19:38.256
So it is known as a very dilapidated building, eerie and containing some very spooky elements of the strange, we might say.

00:19:38.819 --> 00:19:45.353
Imagine trying to shoot a horror suicide movie and you're at a place where there's creepy noises and shit going on everywhere.

00:19:45.773 --> 00:20:11.640
Yeah, yeah, I watched a behind-the-scenes video where Josh Boone, the director, actually when he would hear some of his crew thinking that they heard a supernatural occurrence, he would run to that site and he would actually try to talk to the supernatural to try and actually comfort the crew and, yeah, obviously try and see if anything would happen, because it would add an element of realism and, you know, a fearfulness to the cast and crew.

00:20:11.640 --> 00:20:13.267
That would help the movie in the long run.

00:20:13.267 --> 00:20:17.107
So, yes, Medfield State Hospital very unsettling real world location.

00:20:17.107 --> 00:20:24.222
It's been used in a few other things as well, but I think the main like gothic style hospital that we can think of is Ashfield Hospital from Shutter Island.

00:20:24.222 --> 00:20:27.749
So gothic style hospital that we can think of as Ashfield Hospital from Shutter Island.

00:20:27.749 --> 00:20:28.009
Did I answer?

00:20:28.028 --> 00:20:28.630
that question you did.

00:20:28.630 --> 00:20:29.290
Okay, cool, you smashed it.

00:20:29.811 --> 00:20:31.193
I went above and beyond.

00:20:31.193 --> 00:20:34.522
Very good.

00:20:34.522 --> 00:20:38.904
We know that this movie was originally slated for release in April of 2018.

00:20:38.904 --> 00:20:43.365
It, however, faced some unprecedented delays.

00:20:43.365 --> 00:20:48.131
Why was the new minze delayed so many times before it was released?

00:20:48.131 --> 00:20:50.669
There are two reasons, mainly.

00:20:51.903 --> 00:20:56.107
Well, it wasn't only because it was too dark and they had to reshoot because it was too dark and make it a little bit less dark.

00:20:57.320 --> 00:21:01.359
Not quite, but that is a consequence of one of the things that happened.

00:21:01.359 --> 00:21:04.329
So basically, josh Boone, oh, was it because Disney took over Marvel.

00:21:04.270 --> 00:21:04.804
Yes, that was one of the things that happened.

00:21:04.804 --> 00:21:05.179
So, basically, josh Boone, oh, was it because Disney took over Marvel.

00:21:05.359 --> 00:21:07.228
Yes, that was one of the reasons, exactly right.

00:21:07.228 --> 00:21:12.369
So when Fox was in control, josh Boone made the movie that we see today.

00:21:12.369 --> 00:21:19.766
He made that movie that we see today because Fox was really holding the reins on what he could do in terms of how much horror he could instill into the movie.

00:21:19.766 --> 00:21:29.594
However, when Disney bought Fox and they did some test screenings and ran some teaser trailers and if you remember the teaser trailer, that it was so good, it was so good.

00:21:29.594 --> 00:21:33.290
The Pink Floyd, another Brick in the Wall, that was just perfect.

00:21:33.290 --> 00:21:37.592
That tested so well with audiences that even Disney was like lean into that horror.

00:21:37.592 --> 00:21:43.313
So, when they were actually going to go back to do the reshoots, they were encouraging him to do that, which was very awesome.

00:21:49.940 --> 00:21:51.704
However, they didn't get the time to do it for the second reason that it was delayed.

00:21:51.704 --> 00:21:53.829
You know what that was, I was gonna say well, it was around the same time as covid, exactly right.

00:21:53.829 --> 00:21:56.500
So the covid 19 pandemic stopped this one from being released.

00:21:56.500 --> 00:22:03.622
The theatrical release was delayed again and it was actually going to be opened in august of 2020.

00:22:03.622 --> 00:22:06.250
So I did get did get a theatrical release.

00:22:06.250 --> 00:22:09.446
However, not many people wanted to go and see it because it was the height of the pandemic.

00:22:09.446 --> 00:22:10.505
Prior to that.

00:22:10.505 --> 00:22:18.005
It was also moved around because the X-Men movie I think it was Dark Phoenix, the later one.

00:22:18.005 --> 00:22:21.084
They wanted to move the date of this movie so they didn't coincide.

00:22:21.084 --> 00:22:28.306
Because when Disney purchased Fox they obviously didn't want to double dip across their movies and split their audience, so based a lot of production delays.

00:22:28.306 --> 00:22:29.709
But yes, brashy, it's just such a shame.

00:22:29.729 --> 00:22:33.068
I think, because I thought it was because Disney bought it.

00:22:33.068 --> 00:22:34.968
That's why they went less dark.

00:22:35.761 --> 00:23:00.448
But if Disney wanted to go more dark, such a shame, yeah, and I think that sort of sits in line with the, the, with the way that they've been going, because if you think of how they didn't really hold back on Daredevil Born Again and they haven't really held back on any of the Deadpool movies in terms of their R rating, because that was the big fear as well when Fox and Sony were bought by Disney, that some of their properties would get dulled down to accommodate a Disney audience.

00:23:00.448 --> 00:23:05.986
However, disney has been very good at keeping the tone of most of their productions how the audience likes them.

00:23:05.986 --> 00:23:07.087
But yeah, it was.

00:23:07.107 --> 00:23:16.028
It was just a really, really, really big shame that this one it was kind of always seen as the, the ugly stepbrother, you might say, of the, the superhero movies, because nobody really knew what to do with it.

00:23:16.028 --> 00:23:29.324
They sort of just left it in the background because, as, as you heard, you know, they would prioritize the releases of other movies in their repertoire before they would release the new mutants and then, eventually, they were holding onto it for so long they were just like, okay, we'll drop it in august 2020.

00:23:29.324 --> 00:23:43.192
As a result of all these delays, they weren't ever able to make those major reshoots, for a couple of reasons, the first one being that the actors were three years older and they weren't teenagers anymore, so it was really difficult for them to do that.

00:23:43.192 --> 00:23:47.970
But from april 2018 to august 2020 was how long this movie was held in limbo.

00:23:47.970 --> 00:23:49.613
Basically, pun intended.

00:23:50.201 --> 00:23:52.703
It's going to be something great and like cool.

00:23:52.703 --> 00:24:02.127
If we add some sort of some sort of teasing Wolverine, deadpool, wolverine, these guys that would be cool as well.

00:24:02.648 --> 00:24:02.950
I will.

00:24:02.950 --> 00:24:11.585
You know, with everything happening in the Marvel Universe, I'm not counting it as dead just yet, because there are some characters in here in the X-Men are coming that I would love to see back.

00:24:11.965 --> 00:24:20.146
I absolutely would love to see actually all five and then they Like because realistically now they would be older.

00:24:20.146 --> 00:24:28.316
So, and even though they're older, I still reckon they all sort of look still similar-ish.

00:24:28.316 --> 00:24:32.469
Yeah, like Maisie hasn't really aged since fucking Game of Thrones, really.

00:24:32.469 --> 00:24:36.700
No, absolutely, she's still like shorter of stature and everything like that.

00:24:36.700 --> 00:24:47.371
And I even, out of the joy you still reckon, I reckon she looks a little bit older and a bit more mature, but still looks pretty similar to how she was in the movies, though yeah.

00:24:47.631 --> 00:24:55.446
I reckon that and I'm really hoping that they bring magic back, especially since she's made appearances in that Marvel video game that they made.

00:24:55.446 --> 00:24:56.585
I've got it.

00:24:56.585 --> 00:24:57.423
I can't remember the name of it.

00:24:57.423 --> 00:24:59.884
Now where you use cards oh, snap, marvel, snap.

00:24:59.884 --> 00:25:01.954
I can't remember the name of it now where you use cards, oh, snap, marvel, snap.

00:25:01.954 --> 00:25:02.355
No, not Marvel Snap.

00:25:02.355 --> 00:25:03.119
It's the one Midnight Sun.

00:25:03.820 --> 00:25:05.146
Right Midnight Sun yes, Midnight Sun.

00:25:05.641 --> 00:25:13.191
Yeah, she's prominent in that one, and then she's in New Marvel Rivals and you know, if we're talking about cartoon universes as well.

00:25:13.319 --> 00:25:20.555
X-men 97, morph turned into magic in one of the episodes through that as well, so she has made some appearances since the New Mutants.

00:25:20.555 --> 00:25:33.201
But, yes, I agree, I do hope she returns because, yes, a very big, big star now but a very awesome character to portray on screen, especially with some of the comic books that came later on down.

00:25:33.201 --> 00:25:34.807
The New Mutants run like Inferno.

00:25:34.807 --> 00:25:42.599
That is just a really awesome arc, and even the story of Ileana Rasputin in Limbo that's just a really great story as it stands as well.

00:25:42.599 --> 00:25:44.326
I went to that rabbit hole the other night.

00:25:44.647 --> 00:25:44.807
Yeah.

00:25:45.220 --> 00:25:48.329
We'll probably get into that a little bit later too in the podcast, but we digress.

00:25:48.329 --> 00:25:56.749
I believe it is your question, brash, and the score so far just to score update everybody is two points to add to our pool.

00:25:56.749 --> 00:26:01.123
So we've got a total now of seven points, which means we're sort of halfway there.

00:26:01.123 --> 00:26:07.167
For one of our families to go to the movies on us this month, yeah, all right.

00:26:07.628 --> 00:26:11.612
All right, so Mr Sinister was actually going to be in the movie.

00:26:11.612 --> 00:26:12.972
Do you know who's going?

00:26:12.992 --> 00:26:13.393
to portray him.

00:26:13.393 --> 00:26:16.255
I do, and I actually think it's awesome.

00:26:16.255 --> 00:26:17.276
It is awesome.

00:26:17.276 --> 00:26:18.576
It would be such a good casting.

00:26:18.576 --> 00:26:22.923
He would be an absolute amazing casting.

00:26:22.923 --> 00:26:23.444
I've loved this guy since.

00:26:23.444 --> 00:26:28.362
I've seen him in baby driver, but he obviously had a really awesome role in madman as well.

00:26:28.362 --> 00:26:30.165
We're obviously talking about john ham.

00:26:30.165 --> 00:26:31.869
What a great casting.

00:26:31.869 --> 00:26:35.565
His face shape and his everything is so perfect.

00:26:35.565 --> 00:26:38.009
Yep, absolutely perfect casting.

00:26:38.009 --> 00:26:40.636
And you know, that's another thing that I hope comes back.

00:26:40.636 --> 00:26:41.823
Uh, because, yeah, this this had so much potential.

00:26:41.823 --> 00:26:42.345
And you know, that's another thing that I hope comes back.

00:26:42.345 --> 00:26:43.768
Uh, because, yeah, this this had so much potential.

00:26:43.768 --> 00:26:46.179
And you know and he actually did shoots like yeah, they.

00:26:46.219 --> 00:26:51.585
Actually he had parts in the film, like he had a part in the film, but then when they did the reshoots they had to cut pretty much him.

00:26:51.806 --> 00:27:04.271
Yeah, they were movie yeah, they obviously couldn't do any of the research reshoots to make it make sense, and that was also seen in a couple of the deleted scenes as well If you've got the Blu-ray edition or you can find them online as well.

00:27:04.271 --> 00:27:18.244
But some of the deleted scenes actually were either some of the horror elements that they wanted to keep in or it was some of the elements that they were keeping in to tie it to a couple of sequel films or into the greater X-Men box universe.

00:27:18.244 --> 00:27:25.392
So that would have been where it kind of would be placed, but unfortunately again they weren't allowed to have the the time to to make these reshoots.

00:27:25.392 --> 00:27:28.766
But, john ham, what an amazing choice for mr sinister.

00:27:28.766 --> 00:27:30.592
All right, my turn.

00:27:30.592 --> 00:27:30.913
Here we go.

00:27:30.913 --> 00:27:32.317
All right, here is my question.

00:27:32.657 --> 00:27:42.330
We have noted on this podcast, on this very episode, that the uh, the cgi in this movie is actually quite good, considering it's got a budget of $67 million.

00:27:42.330 --> 00:27:46.326
We know movies that have a budget that is much bigger, that have worse CGI.

00:27:46.326 --> 00:27:55.712
What is the reason that the CGI was so good and also, which mutant's powers was hardest to visually convey?

00:27:56.801 --> 00:27:57.605
This is a hard one.

00:27:57.605 --> 00:28:00.443
I'm not sure, so I'm going to take a stab at the dark with it.

00:28:00.443 --> 00:28:00.885
Do you want your clue?

00:28:00.885 --> 00:28:01.888
Yeah, okay, yeah, actually I'll a hard one.

00:28:01.888 --> 00:28:03.272
I'm not sure, so I'm going to take a stab at the dark with it.

00:28:03.272 --> 00:28:03.795
Do you want your clue?

00:28:03.795 --> 00:28:05.038
Yeah, okay, yeah, actually, I'll take the clue.

00:28:05.058 --> 00:28:29.832
All right, so it is, the mutant whose powers were hardest to portray was the one who, pretty much, was the most powerful one of the five, and it was hard to do because there was a lot of things that they had to include, which combined digital environments, creature effects and seamless transitions between dimensions.

00:28:29.832 --> 00:28:31.364
So obviously it's magic.

00:28:31.364 --> 00:28:32.588
Yes, it's magic.

00:28:33.519 --> 00:28:37.468
And that's who I'll still go against magic, because she has to jump through her portals.

00:28:37.468 --> 00:28:42.411
She also has to get her left arm whenever she summons a sword, soul sword.

00:28:42.411 --> 00:28:45.983
And then also you've got.

00:28:46.003 --> 00:28:56.528
Lockheed, the dragon and the demon bear at the end as well, and the reason that they were able to work so hard on the CGI was because the movie was delayed so long that they had a very long post-production.

00:28:56.528 --> 00:29:03.430
So it was really awesome to see because it really paid off in terms of those teleportation sequences near perfect.

00:29:03.430 --> 00:29:08.833
You could always see a little element of limbo in the background as she was coming to and from different dimensions there.

00:29:08.833 --> 00:29:17.930
When she was in the end scene and she was flipping over the demon bear and slicing her soul slid through and Lockheed himself just looks absolutely amazing and cute.

00:29:17.930 --> 00:29:19.566
He needs to come back as well.

00:29:19.566 --> 00:29:22.824
But yeah, I loved every element of the the cgi in this movie.

00:29:22.824 --> 00:29:23.266
No notes.

00:29:23.266 --> 00:29:24.029
I think it was great.

00:29:24.029 --> 00:29:27.162
I've seen lots of movies that are a thousand times worse with a lot less budget.

00:29:27.182 --> 00:29:40.281
So tap on the shoulder for the new mutants cgi department okay, what was, what was significant about this movie being marvel entertainment and marvel entertainment film specifically?

00:29:40.561 --> 00:29:45.531
was it that marvel didn't actually have anything to do with making this movie?

00:29:45.531 --> 00:29:47.034
Not quite.

00:29:48.541 --> 00:29:55.928
It's a pretty monumental thing and it's the last time any Marvel movie's done this or had this because of the reasons for it.

00:29:56.079 --> 00:30:02.607
I'm pretty sure this has something to do with Stan Lee being the executive producer on the production.

00:30:02.607 --> 00:30:02.888
Is that?

00:30:02.909 --> 00:30:04.432
correct, that is correct.

00:30:04.432 --> 00:30:08.371
It's the very last Marvel Entertainment film that Stan Lee is the executive producer.

00:30:09.019 --> 00:30:14.909
Yes, obviously on account of his passing afterwards, but this is the last one you can see him.

00:30:14.909 --> 00:30:17.542
This is the last one in the credits that you see his name going through.

00:30:17.542 --> 00:30:20.631
Okay, last question, here we go.

00:30:20.631 --> 00:30:27.884
There was, in early drafts of this film, brash in the New Mutants film, a famous Marvel character.

00:30:27.884 --> 00:30:29.067
That was all Bruce included.

00:30:29.067 --> 00:30:34.487
Well, yeah, they were, but this is actually a member of the New Mutants as well.

00:30:35.161 --> 00:30:54.876
Warlock, yes, but yeah, warlock, the techno-organic alien mutant, was originally scripted until the budget constraints came in, because it would be very hard to portray all of the mutant abilities they were trying to put in, as well as a cyborg in there as well, which had very visceral kind of powers that they'd have to try and put in.

00:30:54.876 --> 00:30:59.971
Do you know who they actually were in talks with to play Warlock in this movie?

00:30:59.971 --> 00:31:03.086
I was like it was a strange one for me too.

00:31:03.086 --> 00:31:03.226
It was.

00:31:03.226 --> 00:31:03.807
It was Sasha this movie.

00:31:03.807 --> 00:31:04.888
I was like it was a strange one for me too, it was.

00:31:04.888 --> 00:31:05.991
It was like Sacha Baron Cohen.

00:31:06.092 --> 00:31:12.326
Yes, correct, yeah, you looked at the five cast and then you looked at Sacha Baron Cohen.

00:31:12.326 --> 00:31:13.891
I suppose you wouldn't actually see him.

00:31:13.891 --> 00:31:26.371
No, no, he was going to be motion captured in CGI for the most part it never extended beyond initial talks, just because that budget did sit around 67 to 80 million dollars at the time and which which was small even compared to superhero standards.

00:31:26.371 --> 00:31:36.915
And you know, he was initially going to be almost like that comic relief character to cut through some of the horror elements of the movie at the behest of fox studios.

00:31:36.915 --> 00:31:46.069
But I think that would have even lessened the the impact of those psychological horror elements that we like so much about this movie as well, so I'm actually glad that they didn't include him in there.

00:31:46.559 --> 00:31:52.486
It was actually also rumored that he would appear or Warlock at least would appear in planned sequels.

00:31:52.486 --> 00:32:12.279
This movie had two planned sequels one that would follow the New Mutants going into a space or alien invasion-like adventure and the third one that was going to be a part of this trilogy was going to be the Inferno saga, which would have been awesome, yeah, but I don't know how I'd feel about the alien invasion, because that just seems like three very distinct, different kind of movies that they were trying to make and tie together.

00:32:13.063 --> 00:32:27.555
I suppose, though, it would be in probably perfect new mutant fashion, but I suppose they probably needed if I was to watch this new mutant, and but I suppose they probably needed if, if they're, if I was to watch this new mutant and then then the next one that would go into the invasion, I would find it weird.

00:32:27.555 --> 00:32:38.251
But if they were, did the new mutants like a sort of introduction to all the characters and then, towards the end, coming to warlock and went into space or whatever, like.

00:32:38.251 --> 00:32:47.751
I'd find it a bit more realistic, but I wouldn't be able to see him going from this movie as we got it to going to how to spell, like to the invasion.

00:32:47.771 --> 00:32:48.394
That'd be a bit weird.

00:32:48.394 --> 00:32:49.643
I 100 agree.

00:32:49.643 --> 00:32:52.588
I think it would have been too much of a stretch for us.

00:32:52.588 --> 00:33:08.930
Uh, in that regard and you know even in the the book that this is based off the demon bear saga in issue 18, 19, and 20, it does cut between elements that are occurring between Danny Moonstar and her team in the Demon Bear and outer space elements with Adam Warlock.

00:33:09.039 --> 00:33:13.625
And if you're thinking about it from the perspective of somebody that's reading these, in the 80s they didn't have Marvel Unlimited.

00:33:13.625 --> 00:33:18.148
At the time you couldn't just go down to the comic book shop and pick up all of the issues that you'd previously had before.

00:33:18.148 --> 00:33:20.211
You just get the issues that you'd previously had before.

00:33:20.211 --> 00:33:21.010
You just get the issues that you find.

00:33:21.010 --> 00:33:25.855
And if you miss and can't find issue 18 of the new mutants, then you literally just have to go by the recap that comes in issue 19.

00:33:26.214 --> 00:33:27.997
It wasn't as easily accessible as it was now.

00:33:27.997 --> 00:33:28.297
So it was.

00:33:28.297 --> 00:33:36.813
It was kind of out of place to see, yeah, those starfaring elements in the middle of this spiritual demon bear story.

00:33:36.813 --> 00:33:39.584
But, as I said before, you know that's what they were trying to do with this book.

00:33:39.584 --> 00:33:56.851
They were just trying to experiment and see where they could go in the 90s with the X-Men, because Chris Claremont was just trying new things, because he ended up being a very influential writer and a flagship man in terms of creating lots of titles for the X-Men and he was just spreading his wings and seeing what stuck.

00:33:58.086 --> 00:34:15.610
I would have loved I hope that's something that they might think about in the future but to see these characters when they're older and like in control of their powers, because I'd love to see at this facility being tested on by Cecilia Reyes to see if they could become these killing machines for.

00:34:15.849 --> 00:34:16.789
Mr Sinister.

00:34:16.789 --> 00:34:36.132
So really they were just scratching the surface of what they could do and us, as comic book fans know what they can do and we love to and want to see it on screen.

00:34:36.132 --> 00:34:38.644
But unfortunately we weren't able to and hopefully we do.

00:34:38.644 --> 00:34:45.771
But right now we're going to jump into our set secrets segment with a total of six points from that segment.

00:34:45.771 --> 00:34:53.811
Brash, that means we all got perfect scores and we have a total of 11 points going into our next round of the phantom facts face-off.

00:34:53.811 --> 00:34:58.289
So we need four more points, not too bad very achievable, but it was probably.

00:34:58.329 --> 00:35:03.509
It was pretty hard for me to try and find questions that you probably wouldn't know, because you're I mean, I love x-men.

00:35:03.509 --> 00:35:06.342
I think you're more in that, even more an x-men fan than I am.

00:35:06.342 --> 00:35:09.208
X-men is my jam.

00:35:09.489 --> 00:35:13.757
Ultimate comic nerd, nerddom, I sit in x-men.

00:35:13.757 --> 00:35:19.146
It's the earliest thing that I remember reading yeah, yeah, x-men's, my x-men's, my jam.

00:35:19.588 --> 00:35:28.059
So yeah, it is a hobby, you might say but yeah, all right, let's jump into our set secrets segment.

00:35:28.059 --> 00:35:37.791
This is where hosts look behind the scenes of the focus movie to give you all the information on what went right, what went wrong and what was interesting about the way the movie was made.

00:35:37.791 --> 00:35:42.211
We're talking about the new Mutants movie, made in 2020.

00:35:42.211 --> 00:35:57.791
And we're also going to look quite deeply here at the Easter eggs that are presented in this movie, because there is some very strong influences from horror movies and there's also some very strong X-Men ties in this movie as well.

00:35:58.320 --> 00:36:01.686
I know Nightmare on Elm Street was one of the specifically Nightmare on Elm Street 3.

00:36:01.686 --> 00:36:09.931
One specifically Nightmare on Elm Street 3 was one of the inspirations the Breakfast Club, if you know me enough, and Once Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.

00:36:10.380 --> 00:36:10.822
Yeah, yeah.

00:36:10.822 --> 00:36:39.106
So Once Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest was a very claustrophobic sort of psychological thriller movie starring Jack Nicholson, and in a lot of those scenes in the movie they were in almost like therapy sessions, which is what we saw, with these mutants sitting in a circle talking with uh, with Dr Reyes as well during those movies and the the claustrophobic settings that was really kind of confining and added to the tension of this movie was also present in in one of the cookies nest.

00:36:39.106 --> 00:36:44.449
And you're absolutely right, the Breakfast Club is, you know, that classic 80s movie.

00:36:44.449 --> 00:36:46.092
They're all in there for detention, they're trapped in there.

00:36:46.092 --> 00:36:48.105
There's five of them, there's five of these new mutants.

00:36:48.105 --> 00:37:01.753
I definitely think that Ileana hits the burnout vibe in these ones from the Breakfast Club and, yeah, and you know, roberto fits the jock because in the movies Roberto, or Sunspot, is actually a soccer player as well.

00:37:01.753 --> 00:37:23.476